Ben Seidman Interview

Recently, I had the opportunity to interview the wonderful Ben Seidman. He's an incredible magician, pickpocket and consultant from America. Enjoy!

Jack: Let's start at the beginning, what is your origin story to magic?

Ben: I got into magic like most kids do. I saw someone pull something out of my mom's ear and I was hooked. And then when I was 12, I was doing theatre, and I met this man named Tim Catlett who taught me so much. He was a magician himself and he took me under his wing, taught me a lot of the basics of sleight of hand and an appreciation for constructing a routine. That led to me working at a Brick and Mortar magic shop and that was my origin story into magic.

Jack: Now I understand, that one of your highlights, is that you were the first, and currently the only person, who served as resident magician of the Mandalay Resort Hotel in Vegas. What was that whole experience like for you?

Ben: It was amazing. It was in my early 20s and it was an experience where I got to do close-up magic regularly in Las Vegas. And I learned so much about audience control and what it's like to perform in challenging environments, like for example, loud environments full of drunk people. So that was less about creating effects and more about refining material and becoming a better performer. That time of my life was me being thrown into the fire and forged into a close-up magician.

Jack: I love watching those clips, not just because of the tricks, but the stories you tell in them, connecting you with the audience, on a more personal level. What's your thoughts about that?

Ben: I think that as I reflect on my journey in magic up until this point, I acknowledged that when I was younger, magic by itself was just very exciting to me. And I couldn't imagine why any other human in the world wouldn't be excited just to see a great magic trick and be fooled. And I realize now, later, that isn't necessarily the case. People don't have the love for magic that we do as magicians. Some people do, but many people don't. What everyone does love, whether they know it or not, is a story. Human beings have been hearing and telling stories since the dawn of time; so even though not everyone loves magic, everyone loves narrative in one way or another. And so I've tried to find a way to bridge the gap here. That being said, I think a lot of magicians, myself included in the past, have used story incorrectly. Just because you're telling a story does not mean that it's compelling or interesting. I think some magicians will tell stories that hurt them more than help them. And I think about crafting the narrative, writing the story and delivering it, and how we should treat that process like magic that we are working on. Treat the process like difficult sleight of hand. You should put in a lot of time and work into that and study the greats, like who are the great writers, who are the great conveyors of narrative. I think we need to study those people as much as we study Vernon and Marlo and Tommy Wonder. I find stories to be incredibly important.

Jack: As well as being a world-class and world-recognised performer, you're also well-known for being a theatrical pickpocket. Was magic and pickpocketing always separate or have they worked in tandem with each other? How has your act evolved?

Ben: I started learning magic long before I was ever pickpocketing. And when I was 15 or 16, I found out that you could steal someone's watch and learnt it and then tried it and executed it successfully to my grandma at a family function. And I got really interested in magic that happens to people and that is about them as opposed to look what I can do as a magician. These moments that like we're sharing with people, I think it's much more interesting when the magic happens to them as opposed to watching a magician saying 'I can make things appear and disappear'. And so I got really into it and I've been developing it slowly over time, but it is one of the hardest disciplines in magic. I think it is very difficult. Luckily I've had the good fortune to have studied with Apollo Robbins who's incredible and, maybe the greatest who's ever done it.

Jack: Ben, of all the things that you've done, has there been a real highlight; has there been a standout moment where you think back and you think, 'I'm really proud of that, I'm really happy how that turned out?'

Ben: There have been some sequences that I have developed and executed that were absurdly difficult to pull off. With many of them, I could have cut corners but I decided I didn't want to do that. For example, when I did the Netflix show 'Brainchild', there's an effect where I snap a photo of two people with one of those printable cameras. The photo comes out I ask to borrow her phone. I set the photo that I took of us on top of the phone and she covers it with her hand. When she lifts up her hand, the photo is now inside of her case. She has to open up the case to take it out. And then I asked her to choose a social media platform. She goes to Instagram. And that photo is on her page. It's uploaded to her account. That is an effect where, I could have used a stooge and have done it very easily in five minutes, right? But instead I spent five or six months developing this very complex method to pulled it off. That feels pretty badass.

Jack: That effect is so unique and so different from anything else. In this world that's ever changing, we've got technology coming in, we've got whole new genres of magic. How have you kept magic new and in the forefront?

Ben: Magic is always evolving. A lot of people would answer that magic on social media is the new 'face'. But in most cases when people post social media clips of magic, it doesn't really feel magical when I see those videos. Some are very fooling, but you cannot substitute having something impossible and amazing happening directly in front of you. The industry and the art is ever changing. There are going to be improvements and evolutions. I think that that feeling of magic is pretty hard to replicate if it's not just someone seeing a miracle in front of them. 

Jack: What three tricks could you perform for the rest of your life if these were the only effects you could ever perform.

Ben: That's such a difficult question! I would choose a pickpocketing routine that I do in my show. I'm biased because it's a new thing I'm excited about - I'm working on it now quite a bit. I think I would include that because it will never be finished. Every situation is different when you're doing pickpocketing, you're always adapting to the situation, the people, the clothing. That routine will never stop being a challenge.
For number two, I did something that you saw me do in Blackpool where someone signs their name on a dollar bill. It goes in their pocket. And then a second person signs a bill and the two bills change places. I'd probably throw that on there. I really love performing that. It is still very fun for me to perform that effect. It's just so strong.
And I think the third would have to be Armando Lucero's coin menagerie. I can't do it on stage, but I have to add something that I can do for people up close. For those of you who are not familiar with Armando Lucero's routine, it is a coin matrix routine. It is the best constructed matrix in the world, in my opinion. It doesn't use any gimmicks or extra coins or anything like that. It's a work of art, really strong and just very magical.

Jack: Such a wide and varied selection of effects. Pickpocketing, stage, close-up.

Ben: But you know what? I'm really going to miss Banana Bandana. Just kidding.

Jack: Do you have a process for creating magic? Do you sit down and think, or does it just come naturally?

Ben: I think about magic all of the time. So I just naturally write down ideas when I have them. My memory is pretty bad. So I make notes or voice memo recordings. Every now and then I review these notes. Sometimes there's a nugget of gold there that can be refined. Most ideas never see the light of day. Some are truly terrible or widly impractical. But when I look back at my notes, I see ideas that I scribbled down that I have basically made a career out of. Examples of this are my two appearances on Fool Us. The first one, which I did over 10 years ago, Ring Watch Wallet, a method I designed to recreate the deceptive nature of Tommy Wonders' routine, but without the disadvantages. For my second appearance, it was totally different. That was an effect that didn't exist. I invented it, I came up with the method for it, but it should be noted that the idea of making all of the books disappear was something that came about with the help of a couple of friends. We were coming up with ideas and my friend Sean Bott suggested to me, 'What if you made your books disappear?' And then it eventually evolved down to vanishing all of the books except for one. And this came from tinkering, writing down notes and experimenting to see what happens.

Jack: Do you have any advice for people wanting to get more into pickpocketing, especially young people wanting to including it within their act?

Ben: Sadly, I don't have much advice and I say this because the stakes are very high when you're doing that type of work. It's very easy to think, oh, whatever, worse case scenario you get caught and you say 'oh, I'm a magician, I was stealing for a trick and everyone laughs it off and is fine'. That's not the worst case scenario. And you can get into some real trouble. You can get into some genuinely life or death situations doing this stuff. I had a close call recently. So I actually advise people against it because the liability is too high. You know, people sometimes have weapons on them. There could be a misunderstanding. You could end up in jail. There there's a lot of things that could go wrong. And so I say to people who want to learn this stuff, Hey, if you really want to learn it, make sure you're practicing on and doing this to friends in the safest possible environment. Just be careful.

Jack: Now as well as being at the forefront of performing magic, you've also consulted for a lot of film and TV over the last couple of years, including for the upcoming 'Now You See Me 3' film. Can you tell me more about becoming a magic consultant?

Ben: When I was in Las Vegas, a trick that I invented was introduced to Criss Angel and he said he wanted to do it on his TV show. He bought it from me and then hired me to work as a magic consultant. So I became a magic consultant the moment someone said 'I want to pay you to come up with magic ideas' There's not an official process to becoming a magic consultant' The consulting work is really interesting. I don't do it very much anymore, but I do it occasionally still. It's a fun, interesting and creative challenge. 

Jack: Do you have any advice for young magicians wanting to eventually make magic a full-time career?

Ben: Yes, I have loads. There are so many different ways that you can make a living doing magic. There's also plenty of ways to attempt it and fail. But first you need to decide what you want to do and see if it jives with your skillset. If someone is not a very creative magician and they're just performing tricks that they've learned by buying them online, they're probably not going to make a great magic consultant and they're probably not going to make a living as a magic consultant. Likewise, if you're a great and skilled technical magician and you can do amazing sleight of hand, but you're not good in the room i.e. connecting with your audience, then it's going to be hard making a living as a performer. So I think it's important to define exactly what you want as well as what your skill set is. Then find where they intersect. Work hard, work efficiently and try to follow what your gut instinct tells you. And most importantly, listen to your audiences. You will get the best feedback by actually truly listening to them. I audio record my shows. Video is good too, but audio is also important because once you take out the visuals, is what you're still saying interesting and compelling enough that it'll hold up with audio only? That's a tough barrier to reach past. There's a Demetri Martin quote where he talks about the 'who gives a shit test' And I think that's an interesting test to run your magic through. For example, take cut and restored rope. 'I'm going to take this rope, cut it in half and put it back together' Okay, Who gives a shit? There are beautiful cut and restored rope sequences and ones that are truly deceptive. I'm not saying that it doesn't pass it; I'm just saying that it's worthwhile to run it through that context.

Jack: (laughs) It's a very objective trick. If you could encourage other to seek out the teachings and effects of three magicians, who would you pick?

Ben: One of them is Armando Lucero. I'll give him a little plug here. First of all, he is one of my mentors and is one of a couple of mentors who has changed my life. And the material that he is teaching is incredible. He's a little bit of a hidden secret. Some people don't know his work or that he even publishes because he has been so secretive his whole life. He has something called the 'Hungry Imagination' and it's a subscription service. And you just get absolute gold on magic theory and effects. It's for serious students of magic. The other two magicians I would recommend are David Williamson and Jared Kopf. And those three are also my favorite magicians in the world. And all of them have material published that you can learn. The fact that you can just learn from David Williamson or buy Jared's thoughts and learn from him is incredible.

Jack: What's your most embarrassing story from performing?

Ben: Well, there is this story. I was in a comedy club. I was probably 20 and I brought a guy up on stage. He was blackout drunk. After I performed a routine, this man (this huge man) grabbed my face and licked my face from my chin to my hair, licked open my eyelid. It was not amazing. I should have dismissed him the moment I realized how hammered he was. But I was too young to think ' I should have gotten rid of him and used a different spectator.
Oh, here's another one. I once loaded a card into a very important person's pocket. But I loaded it into the same pocket that held his cell phone. During the effect, this guy got a call, took out his phone, and the card fell to the ground. He didn't see it, and the card was just left on the floor. What could have been this amazing, beautiful moment was nothing. And that was mostly just disappointing because of the person I was doing it for is a big deal. I really wanted him to see a miracle and we had to settle for a magic trick.

Jack: Thanks so much for taking time out of your very busy schedule, you're such an incredible person.

Ben: Thank you so much. It was an honour meeting you.

You can find out more about Ben at his website: www.benseidman.com